Mike says...Should I physically manipulate him into position?

Hi Mike,
I would not do so. I teach articles with no leash, actually basically the same as how Mia demonstrates on how to teach the down without touching the dog on "To Click or Not To Click, Shaping Behaviour" - pages 84 & 85 of the last issue.

This method has worked well for me with multiple dogs. How I start articles is on the training field. I drop an article on the ground. Go and get my dog. The dog is free. No leash. Natural instinct is for a dog to go check out any foreign objects on the field. it looks at the article, click. I feed on the article. I want the dog to realize the article is of value to it. I do not say a word and do not use any body language as I want the dog to start operating and problem solving and to figure out how to make me trigger the click. 10 pieces of food. When the 10 pieces are gone, training session is over. I up the anti each session so next time, I will ask the dog to not only show interest in the article but it must platz on it in order to trigger the click. Then the next sessions work on the dog staring at the article in down position to trigger the click. Then I will use several articles and let the dog randomly choose to platz on articles it sees. That is the point I introduce articles to the track.

Then, the dog knows exactly what to do when it sees the article on the track and stress is not introduced onto the track. I then use the clicker to teach the dog to stare at the track and not look back at me once it has platzed. Once the dog has indicated an article on the track, if it turns to look at me, I stop. The dog must look forward. Click. I move forward. This is the reward as the dog wants me to hurry up and get to it as it has association that when I am up to it, then it gets paid. When I get to the dog, if the dog looks at me. Nothing. It must stare at the article. The second it does, click. I feed on the article.

I also use regulation articles in teaching articles so the dog starts to have association with articles that size and type.

Beautiful video Claudio! Thanks so much for sharing.

Jane

Hi Mike,

Jane gave a good explanation how to use the clicker with objects. It is the “basic principle” of using the clicker.

Never the less, sometimes is not easy use the clicker method without knowing some principles of this technic and what is beyond of it.

I will try to give a different approach to the problem with goal that could be more easy for you to use it. I’m not saying that it’s better.

Some times in training it’s better start all over again than trying different things very often. specially when we are not sure if we are doing things right.

My first advice, i don’t know if it is possible, is you try to find someone who could help and see what’s going on with your training.

My second advice is: Chose a method and stay with that method for some time.

If the dog have a good drive with food you should use the food. In this case using food is also good because you don’t want your dog very excited (playing) after he identifies an object.

In my opinion at this stage you shouldn’t give the command platz to the dog or force the dog to lay dow. You will create a conflict with the dog, with the exercise and with the command platz.

Forget the object.

Try to use a small box with food (Small pieces of chicken or sausage). Let the dog smell. When he starts to be excited and anxious put the box in the floor ( you should be in a lower position) with your hand over the box. If he barks, if he try to get the box with his mouth or what ever you stay calm.

The dog after a while will start to find a way to get the box. Because you and the box are in a lower position he will lay down. In this moment you give him the jackpot (open the box - let the dog eat). Do this with small pieces of food and repeat the process.

Obs. - time to time you can do this with his own meal. After repeating the exercise two times you give the remaining meal.

You do this off the track.

When he starts to identify the box you will use as an object in the track. Just the box. In training session (during the track) you go (with the leash) right after him just to make sure that he lays down when he find the box. If he does, you say platz ( you don’t miss the command because the dog is already in the platz position) and very quickly you open the box. Let the dog eat and after that play with the dog.

If by any chance the dog doesn’t lay down when he gets to the box you repeat the same thing you’ve done in the training sessions off the track.

Note: You should only use the box in the track after you are “100” sure that the dog without any help, lays down when he sees the box.

In my opinion and its just my opinion (without seeing the problem, the situation and the way you interact with the dog) you should focus in this exercise and stop tracking.

When using the box in the tracking for the first time, do just a small straight line with the box in the end. Now what you are working is this situation and not the way the dog is tracking.

Obs. - If your dog in the apport exercise, chew the apport, you will not correct the problem by just doing all the sequence of the exercise. You must be focus in that particular problem.

Try that and give us feedback. The main goal is the dog see the box and lay down by himself.

all the best

Cláudio Nogueira
www.amigodorottweiler.com

Claudio-- I made video of me trying to teach this to my dog, I wanted to post here for discussion as I am up for learning what I am doing wrong. BUT How do you get a video up here? I am assuming you need to put it on youtube first? Can you please explain this? Thanks

Mike

Hello Mike,

as you can read,there are many ways to teach the articles and I'm sure a lot of them are good ways.
I can only tell you how I teach them and hopefully,you can get some 'usefull' information in it!
After a few tracks with my dog (pupy or young dog),I allready introduce the article on the track. I allways put a part of food at the end of track and just in front of the food,I put my article. Every dog will stop automaticly at the food to eat it and because he stops,you can push him gently (without any presure) in the down position. I keep on doing this and little by little,the dog will realise that he has to go down with the food (reward) but he also makes the link with the artcile because this is allways together with the food,so the dog will link the article by reward (allways place the artcile in front of the food,if not,you learn the dog to walk over it!!).
When you notice that the dog is going down by himself,I introduce the article on the track and do the same with a little bit food together with the artcile on the track. Again,in the beginning the dog will stop for the food and if necessarey,I help my dog in the down position.
This way,I don't make any presure on my dog,the dog is making the link with 'article - food (rewarding)' and you learn the dog imediatly to lay down in the correct direction.
Little by little,you take away the food with the article. The dog will react by himself when he arrives with the article (because he is expecting food). If needed,you help the dog and as soon as he lays down,you reward him with food from your hand! (allways bring the hand in front of the dog,just between his leggs so he stays in perfect direction)
This is a easy way to learn and a clear way to the dog!! You also make the positive link with the article!
sometimes it can be intresting to use an article with food in it. This can be the step between 'food with the article and skipping the food'..
I think it's not so easy to write down everything because a lot is depending on the character and drives of the dog on tracking but I hope you can use something of all this...
Nick

Hello,

About the video...Yes, you must publish the video on youtube first. Then you just need to copy the link (URL) to the post.

all the best

Cláudio Nogueira
www.amigodorottweiler.com

thanks very much everyone for the help. Nick I am going to give your method a shot and see which one works best for my dog. I am going to try and get video up of this going on so maybe we could discuss it further. Thank you all again for your time.

Mike